barefootskater (Shaun)
barefootskater (Shaun) UberDork
12/6/20 1:48 a.m.

In reply to Robbie (Forum Supporter) :

"Provided the end result is substantially similar in general appearance"

Fairly sure it would be just that. Identical even. I fail to see the issue. Of course, I'm not offering to do the job either...

sleepyhead the buffalo
sleepyhead the buffalo Mod Squad
12/6/20 7:38 a.m.
Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:

Well. Just scored a VERY large roll of fiberglass cloth. It seems to be 1.5 oz so it is extremely thin, and I'll need to use a lot of layers in any parts I make.

The good news is, the thin stuff should drape into compound curves a bit better.

see if you can find some uni-directional carbon tape (1" or 2" wide), or "tow".  you can do a lot of stiffening with a little bit of carbon, and the uni is lot cheaper than weave.  Just think of laying it down like wood-grain to add stiffness.

DeadSkunk  (Warren)
DeadSkunk (Warren) PowerDork
12/6/20 7:40 a.m.

Ed Malle showed up with a nice Fox body Mustang a few years ago. Every bolt-on panel on the car was fiberglass....doors, front fenders and hood, and trunk lid. I would do the same to my Corolla if I had the time ,skills and budget room to do it.

nocones
nocones UltraDork
12/6/20 8:59 a.m.

Don't worry there will be a car there that pushes that rule to the strained extreme next year.  Parts of my car will still look like a Subaru 360.   I mean technically it's all still there just relocated relative to each other.  There is very little of the OEM sheet metal that isn't going to make it on the car but it will look nothing like it's supposed to.  

I'll be a bit miffed if I end up having to run exhibition but it is what it is.  I'm. Building the car for me and I think it meets the intent of the competition.  What can you do for $2000 that will also grab attention and sell magazines.  Your car seems like it would be fine with a full fiberglass body because it already showed up as is.  Next year would just be a natural evolution and it is a common way to build a real race car.  Shouldn't that be challenge legal? 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
12/6/20 11:16 a.m.

I think I'd be able to make a logical argument in my favor, but the real issue I have is how it looks to show up with a car that to outsiders or newbies looks like something that is in flagrant violation of the rules. If I'm another competitor and spend a pile of time building a car to the rules, I'm not happy when a car is allowed to compete that seems to skirt a pretty major rule. I'm actually one of the people who has been asking for better enforcement of some of the safety rules because of how it puts people who follow the rules at a disadvantage.

Anyway, leaving my high horse aside, I'm not above replacing panels with fiberglass. And I plan to make significant aero changes to the car while leaving enough to be "substantially similar". I think I'm hoping to end up very similar to nocones, with a car that looks like it is a mix of an lmp1 car and a datsun roadster. But I don't think I can convince myself to remove the body entirely from the vehicle or the budget.

Here's a crude drawing I did:

Plus, exterior sheet metal all by itself is already in the right shape and very light. I just need to cut a lot of the inner stuff away.

nocones
nocones UltraDork
12/6/20 11:52 a.m.

In reply to Robbie (Forum Supporter) :

oohh..   Lookie what I found in the Sketchup Library...

What's the OD and Width of your Tires?  My Sketchup brain is going into overload on ideas for your ride..

 

Honestly you should put shocks on it.  Swap the Pucks for some R1 type shocks.  I think with the extra weight of the body the pucks are just overwhelmed.  Next spring I'd love to go to a CCSCC event you're at (perhaps the Grudge Match Event 3 extra runs in each others cars) and we could swap cars (You could drive the MG, unless the LMP360 is running by then).  

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
12/6/20 1:11 p.m.

I'd love to get some grudge match action in. 

Tires are 19.5*7.5*10, but they measure more like 18.5 by 9.5 installed on these 10*8 inch wheels.

For suspension, I agree real suspension would be good. But I'm first going to fix the weight of the body issue, and replace the ancient rubber pucks with fresh rubber to see where I'm at. I also found that my bouncing issue may have been related to a rebound problem in the rear, not a bump travel issue (the way I have it setup, there is a rubber pucks for bump, but in rebound the swingarm hits the chassis basically metal to metal - I think that was my most major problem). The rear suspension currently "works" like bouncing a steel ball on an anvil! Oops.

Apexcarver
Apexcarver UltimaDork
12/6/20 7:00 p.m.

Get me a pic of the pucks you are running with a measurement to be sure. I have a sheet of the stuff and can cut you a set if it's the same as mine.

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
1/2/21 1:03 p.m.
Apexcarver said:

Get me a pic of the pucks you are running with a measurement to be sure. I have a sheet of the stuff and can cut you a set if it's the same as mine.

Hey, I haven't forgotten about this incredible offer. I just haven't been able to get in there and get good measurements for you yet. I'll pm you when I'm ready.

 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
1/2/21 1:13 p.m.

In other news, I've been mostly working on cleaning up the shop and selling stuff to get things out of the way.

But I did connect with a guy on fb marketplace and was able to make a trade that will benefit the budget! Since recoup is maxed, trades are key.

I traded the cbr600 front forks for a fuel pump, a throttle body, a rear shock, a complete set of 8 fuel injectors and lines, a voltage regulator, and some extra radiator hoses. Since I had to buy a fuel pump and a throttle body from eBay in last year's build, I can now swap those parts out and get $86 back from the fuel pump and $35 back for the throttle body! Also I spent nearly $40 on 1" radiator hose, so I may be able to remove all or most of that cost as well. He also agreed to give me a used battery and a taillight, but he couldn't find the taillight and the battery was leaking acid, so he offered to give me $20 to buy that stuff instead.

All in all a pretty big relief to the budget of maybe $150 or so! 

PLUS - I now have a second rear shock, which allows me to start thinking about suspending this beast. 

PLUS PLUS - I now have a separate fuel system i can use to bench test and flow some injectors to see if e85 is plausible.

So, while $ for $ I probably lost a bit in the trade, for challenge budget purposes I feel like I made out like a bandit.

Mr_Asa
Mr_Asa UberDork
5/4/21 12:04 a.m.

So, um, update?

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
5/4/21 10:38 a.m.
Mr_Asa said:

So, um, update?

Funny you mention. I wasn't falling asleep immediately last night and actually spent some time thinking about this. I've been focused on a few different projects, and now that the engine is mounted in the MGB I'll be getting it down off the lift and then I've got to fix the gas tank routing on the jag. After than, the sawzall comes back out on the datsun. 

nocones
nocones UberDork
5/4/21 10:52 a.m.

Oh yeah bout to get really sawzally up in here.

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
5/18/21 9:53 a.m.

Also, I have just purchased a used boss boss nitrous system for $100. These are mainly aimed at snowmobiles, but they are cool because they are "wet" kits with only one jet. The jet is hooked to the nitrous and to an atmospheric fuel tank, and when the pressurized nitrous flows through the jet, it pulls the fuel needed with it via Bernoulli. Pretty smart.

Anyway, we will see how boss noss works out later. Weight reduction, body reinforcement, and aero first!

TVR Scott
TVR Scott SuperDork
5/18/21 10:20 a.m.

So you're basically adding a nitrous carburetor to it.  Nice!

You going to sub in something different for shocks?  I recall you saying it was a pretty rough ride with the body weight added.

BTW, I remain totally jealous of your shop space.  I could never have three projects going at once!  One is absolutely the max.

maschinenbau
maschinenbau UltraDork
5/18/21 11:29 a.m.

Aw yeah. Feelin that Big Datsun Energy.

nocones
nocones UberDork
5/18/21 11:53 a.m.

IT'S HAPPENING!!

gumby
gumby Dork
5/18/21 3:51 p.m.

5 months till Challenge

*yawning, stretching, slaps knee* Welp, better get started...

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
5/19/21 10:24 a.m.

First up, unbolt approximately $215 of budget (yes, while cool, the aero wing support hit budget at $100 and the eBay wing at $114 - if I can recreate similar pieces of my own accord I get mucho $$ back).

This view feels familiar to me...

I love having everything in the shop on wheels. 

Each scale reads about 143. So that means the body currently sits at a staggering 286 lbs. Ouch. Goal is to get that down by exactly one Robbie (about 185 lbs). It does look like a majority of the weight is in the rockers. 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
5/19/21 10:31 a.m.
TVR Scott said:

So you're basically adding a nitrous carburetor to it.  Nice!

You going to sub in something different for shocks?  I recall you saying it was a pretty rough ride with the body weight added.

BTW, I remain totally jealous of your shop space.  I could never have three projects going at once!  One is absolutely the max.

Yes yes yes, a nitrous carb... exactly!

For the bounce, the first plan is to kiss. Replace rubber with fresh. Reduce body weight massively (hur hur hur). Test and then see. But I do have 3 matching MC rear coil overs, and a fourth is very cheap. 

As to shop space, get everything on wheels. Sweep frequently. 

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
5/19/21 10:32 a.m.
gumby said:

5 months till Challenge

*yawning, stretching, slaps knee* Welp, better get started...

451 hours.

maschinenbau
maschinenbau UltraDork
5/19/21 12:04 p.m.

Join team fiberglass with me and Gumby

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
5/26/21 10:52 a.m.

Been busy with family over and sprucing up the house for spring, but I managed to get in an hour yesterday.

First, channel the right stuff with gear.

Next cut out doors that were carefully welded in before.

Next I started removing the front fenders but stuck rusty fasteners were slowing my roll. More on that later.

Also, this arrived in the mail! 2 fuel "injectors", 2 nitrous "injectors", lines, fittings, bottle, bottle mounts, button, and battery powered controller (yes, if you load this guy up with 8 AA batteries it is completely standalone from the vehicles electronic system) for $100. 

452 hours.

Mr_Asa
Mr_Asa UberDork
5/26/21 10:58 a.m.
Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:

and battery powered controller (yes, if you load this guy up with 8 AA batteries it is completely standalone from the vehicles electronic system) for $100. 

452 hours.

Guy I was stationed with bought a "Sneaky Pete" nitrous system that he could wire into a rental car when he went home on leave.  Plugged into the cigarette lighter and had a pushbutton activator switch that you zip tied to the steering wheel.

I never thought I would see anything jankier than that.  Congrats, my friend.

GIF by Broad City

Robbie (Forum Supporter)
Robbie (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
5/26/21 11:08 a.m.

In reply to Mr_Asa :

from a 'car' perspective it's a pretty small system, like 30 hp or so (I need to look into see exactly what size it is). But if you rigged up a small fuel canister to it (no pressure or pump needed) with something like a motorcycle petcock, you would have a system that would fit easily into an engine bay and then run the button through the hood and window to the driver seat. You could probably make a single line that would just push fit onto a vacuum nipple somewhere on the intake manifold, for the single to connection to the engine needed. 

You could put the whole thing into something about the size of a 12 pack. Maybe I should go find an old four loko box...

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