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sleepyhead the buffalo
sleepyhead the buffalo Mod Squad
12/4/19 7:18 a.m.

So, I dig it.

I'm a little torn about whether going to a central fin/wing mount and end supports tied to the diffuser would work/look... but I can see how fabrication of the current side supports will be easier... and probably make getting in to the engine easier.

i think the rear would benefit, both aerodynamically and visually, from the edition of a 'deck spoiler' along the back, just behind the 360's venting... maybe tying in to the rear wing support?

but, that's all imho... ymmv, caveats abound, etc. wink

nocones UltraDork
12/6/19 12:08 p.m.

I tried your suggestions.  It does look a little more "LMP".  I like it.

I was also talking to a friend about the car and he suggested that I modify my plan to use 25" OD tires.  The original rendering is 22".  That was a big change.  The fenders had to come up almost 3.5".  It works and now that I see it finished it looks better and will have better future wheel availability.  Also I will be able to run SCCA Spec Coupe Subaru Rim sizes (17x8 w/ 245/40R17) which will be nice again for the future.  

Here is the comparison new to old.


slowbird Dork
12/6/19 12:34 p.m.

This. Is. Awesome.

nocones UltraDork
12/6/19 8:09 p.m.

Thanks everyone.  I promise eventually I will move from digital to physical.  Its been a while since I used SketchUp, I forgot how powerful it can be.  I made a video of a walk around of the car.  I also added random License free music to give that a go.  


jfryjfry Dork
12/6/19 10:54 p.m.

As I look at it, I’m not seeing where the suspension will go??

just pesky details to work out later I guess. Haha

SVreX MegaDork
12/7/19 6:59 a.m.

Holy crap!  How have I missed this??

I’ve known this car was hanging from your ceiling since I sold it to you- I am super excited to see progress!!

You have a PM

nocones UltraDork
12/7/19 7:33 a.m.

In reply to jfryjfry :

Do you mean like suspension travel?  The model has about 1" of bump available and generally I render stuff 1" Bellow actual.  For some reason a car with 3" of ground clearance looks like a monster truck so I will render it closer to 2".  The MG was the same way.  

As for suspension arms and shocks there is space under the body for them.  I was going to run pullrods on this build which makes the suspension really short vertically.  For the rear I may run a DeDion  rear so I don't have  a lower arm which saves space also.

TurnerX19 Dork
12/7/19 8:05 a.m.

Even a DeDion needs lateral location. so a lower arm on one side at least, unless you want the roll center to be above the transaxle..I am a big fan of DeDion, and want to see you pull (rod) it off. I would contemplate a triangular lower arm ala Alfetta to accomplish low roll center, possibly with the chassis point behind the transaxle. Or, perhaps, a fixed length half shaft on one side, if the Subaru trans can handle it.

sleepyhead the buffalo
sleepyhead the buffalo Mod Squad
12/8/19 2:17 p.m.

It's not real clear to me... but, is that a 2 or 3 surface wing?  What's the overall chord (leading edge to trailing edge, following the angle of attack {I.e. not the dimensions taken from directly above}), and the wing span?

I realize you kinda just slammed the fin/uprights in there... but, if you give me the wing dimensions, we can probably ballpark the force numbers, which will lead to some follow-on discussion of structures.

Robbie MegaDork
12/9/19 10:51 a.m.

In reply to sleepyhead the buffalo :

Hey Robbie - do you have a spreadsheet for that?

why, yes, yes I do:

If you want me to plug in your chord and width numbers let me know. 

Also, I have this one:

Mike924 Reader
12/9/19 11:43 a.m.


A bit of encouragement for you here. 


Based on the 991 GT3

sleepyhead the buffalo
sleepyhead the buffalo Mod Squad
12/9/19 11:54 a.m.

I think you'll want to add rows to 150mph, imho.  Might be ambitious... but maybe possible.

There's a couple concerns with the endplates/fin... one of which is that we'll want to WAG a number in for their side force due to Beta.  Primarily, the fin and endplates will need to resist the column bending vertical load from over 1000#s of downforce, but also single clamped beam bending from the side-load due cross-path wind.

This side-load is (seemingly) frequently overlooked; and it's possible that the structure to support the required column strength is enough to also handle this... but better to put a ballpark on it, than just assume it's okay and then have the thing fall off at 120mph.

12/9/19 12:23 p.m.

Is the Subaru out of the rafters yet?

Stocked up on cutting wheels for the grinder?

Looking forward to some "Car" nage.


Hoondavan Reader
12/9/19 7:42 p.m.

Image result for gif so much win

captainawesome HalfDork
12/10/19 12:27 p.m.

Would center driving position be possible? Seems like there isn't much room anyway for passenger, but if it makes shifter linkage a beast I could see that being a possible issue.

nocones UltraDork
12/10/19 1:04 p.m.

In reply to captainawesome :

It would be possible but I would like to avoid it.  If I keep the driver hips to left or right it is a 2 seater and has different classing.  

I am actually holding out some hope that I could offset the passenger seat slightly and potentially keep it an actual 2 seater.  Kinda like a smart car.  The car somewhat comfortably held 2 1960s humans.

12/10/19 1:05 p.m.

In reply to captainawesome :

You are reading my mind!

captainawesome HalfDork
12/10/19 1:07 p.m.
nocones said:

In reply to captainawesome :

It would be possible but I would like to avoid it.  If I keep the driver hips to left or right it is a 2 seater and has different classing.  

I am actually holding out some hope that I could offset the passenger seat slightly and potentially keep it an actual 2 seater.  Kinda like a smart car.  The car somewhat comfortably held 2 1960s humans.

I didn't even consider classing when suggesting that. Where does this fall in Mod?

nocones UltraDork
12/10/19 1:09 p.m.

I will definitely look for input in aero.  Everything is just kinda for looks right now.  It's more Aero themed then legit aero of any specific size.  

I could use some help on general underbody air control theory and wing size for a balanced performance with the front aero.  

Not sure when I will get into that.  I'm going to size the rear for as large of a diffuser as possible.  The front I was planning to do a large splitter with vented rear before a flat floor (possibly with skirts) starts at the front axle.  If I run skirts I would have the elevated Chanel to have it have an inlet.  For now I have it rendered that way because it looks nice.  If it makes more sense to just do a full width flat splitter I will do that.

Aero development will come over time as the Sparks start to fly.


For now I am trying to figure out roll bar sizing and sourcing a tube bender and chassis steel.

Jumper K Balls (Trent)
Jumper K Balls (Trent) PowerDork
12/13/19 9:52 a.m.

Here I am waiting for a part to cool, browsing GRM and I think. Wonder whats going on in the challenge forum. I rarely check in here for some reason.


Then this


nocones UltraDork
12/17/19 11:52 p.m.

Need a little help from the experienced drag racers.


I'm trying to ensure that I build a sufficient cage for NHRA legality.    NHRA cage for tube frame is a bit strange.

My conclusion is:

tube size is 1-5/8 *.118 min wal for DOM for basically all tubes

geometry is fairly standard

the "tube frame" requirement is a piece of Min 2"x2" box section on both sides of the driver that the cage ties to.  

There are standards for welding plates which I will use beneath any roll bar attachement.

Does this chassis look essentially legal (realize it's missing rear braces and a main hoop cross brace.  The floor perimeter is 2x2 .058 MS

davbro New Reader
12/18/19 1:14 a.m.

Good Lord!!!! Amazing project!

captainawesome HalfDork
12/18/19 7:41 a.m.

Can you put a human in the seat with helmet for scale?


FuzzWuzzy HalfDork
12/18/19 11:46 a.m.

Can you also run a quick class on how to put amazing things like this in to SketchUp because jfc idc if it ever gets built, I just wanna keep looking at these drawings.

maschinenbau SuperDork
12/18/19 12:33 p.m.

You sure you need a full cage? A roll bar is sufficient down into the 10's, and the diagonal side supports can really stiffen the car. 

I built Datsaniti's roll bar out of 1-3/4 x .120 ERW tube, because it was so damn cheap. And you can buy pre-bent main hoops from Amazon for ~$40 shipped... just search this P/N in Amazon.


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