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Tim Suddard
Tim Suddard Publisher
3/28/22 7:05 a.m.

Its hard to beat Honda build quality. I have been driving Hondas as my daily drivers for nearly 20 years and have had very few problems.

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
3/28/22 9:31 a.m.

In reply to DrBoost :

I wear what is comfortable and what I like.  I don't really care what others like.  I drive a Subaru with loud graphics around town sometimes too.  Again, not really a consideration for me if others find it overboard.  
 

You could broaden your car and clothing options if you worried less too.  

DrBoost
DrBoost MegaDork
3/28/22 9:57 a.m.

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

I get what you're saying. I actually think we are more aligned than you think. I don't think I expressed myself very clearly. Personally I think the Honda is ugly as sin. I wouldn't drive it because it's too ugly for my tastes. Just like there are clothes that may be comfortable to wear, but I won't wear them. I'm sure that's the same for you, and just about everyone else.  
When I look back at the cars I've owned, there are quite a few cars that weren't great performers, but were chosen because of some other trait that endeared them to me. It doesn't have to be fast (or agile, or quick, etc.), it doesn't have to be beautiful. 

My gripes about the CTR are twofold:
1 - I currently have a Honda Odyssey. It's been a turd and is a seemingly constant source of problems. I have grown to dislike the brand. Biased much? Yup. Been burned and don't like the engineering I see in the minivan.
2 - I don't like cars that are over styled. The current crop of Japanese cars, trucks, and SUVs are garish (not all, but quite a few). When I get out of my car and turn around and look at it and think "man, that's a good looking mini" or "that Jeep looks great", that's a good feeling. And it's a feeling I have, not someone else in the parking lot. If I drove the CTR, even though I know I'm driving a car with HUGE bang-for-the-buck, I wouldn't turn around to look at it again. Heck, I'd probably walk quickly to disassociate myself with it LOL. 

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim MegaDork
3/28/22 10:27 a.m.

In reply to DrBoost :

I totally agree on the overstyled, and I don't think that it's only Japanese cars - look at BMW's "honest I'm not snorting white powder" nostrils, Audi's grilles that also seem to be hell bent on consuming the whole car, pickup truck fronts that are getting more and more aggressive and are the size and height of a 1950s ranch style house and so on.

That's actually why the Golf R made it onto my list, because it's one of the cars that doesn't look like it was covered in glue and crashed into the cheap tat accessory aisle.

I also don't think that late model vehicles are getting more reliable long term, and I'm pretty sure they're getting more costly to repair because in a lot of cases, the units/modules that have to get swapped out are getting larger and more expensive. But then again, that was already the case with a certain R63.

docwyte
docwyte PowerDork
3/28/22 12:07 p.m.

There's a reason I ended up with a 2018 Land Cruiser vs some other SUV.  It's simple, it's reliable and while I wouldn't call it good looking it's handsome enough compared to many other over styled SUV's on the market

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
3/28/22 1:04 p.m.

In reply to DrBoost :

I hear you and yes we are more in alignment than it may seem to others.  I don't like being burned by any purchase either.  I'm not one to rant and rave about it on Yelp, but I will take my money elsewhere in the future.  One of the reasons I ordered a '22 Si instead of buying used (other than used prices are over MSRP new), is that I like the more subdued look of the '22.  It has a small lip spoiler instead of the rear wing.  The R has a double rear wing which really shouts look at me.  As an example I prefer the understated look of the Bullitt Mustang to the Mach1 or GT350 currently.  It's almost the same performance, but a more understated package all around. 

 

DrBoost
DrBoost MegaDork
3/28/22 2:28 p.m.
BoxheadTim said:

In reply to DrBoost :

I totally agree on the overstyled, and I don't think that it's only Japanese cars - look at BMW's "honest I'm not snorting white powder" nostrils, Audi's grilles that also seem to be hell bent on consuming the whole car, pickup truck fronts that are getting more and more aggressive and are the size and height of a 1950s ranch style house and so on.

That's actually why the Golf R made it onto my list, because it's one of the cars that doesn't look like it was covered in glue and crashed into the cheap tat accessory aisle.

I also don't think that late model vehicles are getting more reliable long term, and I'm pretty sure they're getting more costly to repair because in a lot of cases, the units/modules that have to get swapped out are getting larger and more expensive. But then again, that was already the case with a certain R63.

I (somehow) forgot about the horrible pickup trucks I see, most notably the Toyota and GM front ends. And the first time I saw a current BMW Bucky Beaver front end I thought it was a photoshop job. Goodness gracous!  

DrBoost
DrBoost MegaDork
3/28/22 2:29 p.m.

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

The Bullitt vs Mach1 and GT350 is dead on. 

Opti
Opti Dork
3/28/22 9:56 p.m.

The ATSV is a superb car, understated and very capable. Avoid the auto.

Have it serviced at the Chevy dealer

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim MegaDork
4/1/22 8:17 a.m.

Well, it looks like the new GRorolla might be another option.

OTOH I'm veering off course already, thinking about thinning out the car collection and get a Porsche 996 or 997 without an IMS bearing.

pinchvalve (Forum Supporter)
pinchvalve (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/1/22 9:09 a.m.

In reply to BoxheadTim :

I walked into one dealer unannounced and asked to look at an sit in a regular Elantra, just to get a sense of the size. They were 100% cool about it, even knowing there was almost no chance they would sell me anything. The local dealer that had an EN on the lot was straightforward. I asked to go see it and arranged a time later that day. They called me before I left and told me it was sold, saving me a drive. They called me the next morning and told me the buyer fell through (didn't want to drive 7 hours for it) so I went to see it. They moved a bunch of cars out of the way so that I could test drive it. Gave me keys and told me to be back eventually. They didn't offer any deals on the car, but they didn't mark it up either. I wanted $20K more than they offered for my beloved FiST LOL, but the offer was fair. No high-pressure tactics, no shenanigans at the finance desk, great finance rate, I left happy. 

I am hearing horror stories on the web from other buyers, but my my dealer and (and perhaps my credit score) made the process simple and stress free for me. 

docwyte
docwyte PowerDork
4/1/22 9:13 a.m.

In reply to BoxheadTim :

So like many on this forum, I tend to cycle through cars pretty quickly.  Anywhere from 6-18 months usually.  I've had my 996 Turbo for over 3 years and have NO intention of selling it, it's a keeper.  Unless I can somehow come up with a ton of money for a 997 GT3RS (I wish!) I'm always going to have it.

Simply put, it's a fabulous car, powerful, comfortable, reliable.  Quit screwing around and go buy one

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim MegaDork
4/1/22 12:55 p.m.

In reply to docwyte :

If I don't mind something with more miles, a 997 turbo would be within reach. The price range still makes me a tad queasy, though.

ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter)
ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) HalfDork
4/1/22 1:36 p.m.

I love everything Porsche and would love to own one again in the future.  And relative to other brands, they tend to be quite reliable.  That said, if important things do break the repair costs are exorbitant.  You are in the world of $20k+ motors and transmissions, and the 996/997 era wasn't exactly bulletproof.  I think with Porsche you always have to consider not just the cost to buy but the cost to own.

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim MegaDork
4/1/22 3:02 p.m.

In reply to ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) :

You've seen my comment about "996/997 without IMS", right ? Those are a lot more reliable than the ones with.

And yes, I've got some idea how much it costs to maintain and run a 911 - I've got an aircooled one evenly spread around the garage and have had the displeasure of having to get a 996 engine rebuilt. And the one before the 996 also had a directly pipeline into my wallet.

I don't think there was ever an era of bulletproof 911s, they all have issues in some area on another. Yet other than an NSX, there aren't that many cars in this performance bracket that are that reliable.

Mmmmmmm. NSX.

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
4/1/22 6:10 p.m.
BoxheadTim said:

In reply to ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) :

You've seen my comment about "996/997 without IMS", right ? Those are a lot more reliable than the ones with.

All Porsche flat 6 engines have an IMS....... IMS = intermediate shaft. 

 

Sonic
Sonic UberDork
4/1/22 7:08 p.m.

In reply to BoxheadTim :

The offer to test drive mine still stands if you are ever near Reading, PA.  The only repair I've made in nearly 5 years is a clutch slave cyl.  It was under $100 and took less than an hour.  I do now need to replace a CV boot that tire though.   Got the new boot from Honda for $40, should take me less than 2 hours to fix.  I'll take that kind of reliability any day.  

docwyte
docwyte PowerDork
4/2/22 10:42 a.m.

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

But the Turbo's and GT cars are based on the older GT1 motor, which doesn't really have an IMS and certainly doesn't have the IMS/RMS/cylinder wall issues that plague the "normal" 996/7 motors

docwyte
docwyte PowerDork
4/2/22 10:43 a.m.

In reply to BoxheadTim :

I like the way the 997 looks, exterior/interior but found that the 996 drove better.  The 997 feels more clinical.  While the entry price is higher you won't lose money on it.  Granted I bought mine 3 years ago before things got silly but it's worth almost double what I paid...

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim MegaDork
4/2/22 11:07 a.m.

In reply to docwyte :

Sounds like I may have to drive both then. How horrible laugh.

One reason that the 997 appeals is that if I really hold my nose on the money side of things, I can get a PDK one within an expanded budget. That would mean my wife could drive it as well, which would be useful. OTOH I didn't find the Tiptronic on our previous 996 that bad, and the turbo has 50% more oomph to make up for any shortcomings on the transmission end of things.

BoxheadTim
BoxheadTim MegaDork
4/2/22 11:14 a.m.

In reply to Sonic :

Thank you, I'll definitely keep that in mind before I make expensive decisions.

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
4/2/22 7:53 p.m.
docwyte said:

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

But the Turbo's and GT cars are based on the older GT1 motor, which doesn't really have an IMS and certainly doesn't have the IMS/RMS/cylinder wall issues that plague the "normal" 996/7 motors

It sure as heck does have an IMS.  I'm not sure what you guys think times the entire engine in a Porsche flat 6, but it sure as heck is the IMS.  The problem is the IMS BEARING.  In the M96/97 engines the IMS bearing is a roller bearing and isn't fed lubrication.  Porsche 911s had an IMS from 1965 until the 991 came out with the 9A1 engine.  So from 1965 to 2011? 

So the only way you are buying a Porsche without an IMS is to get one that is LS swapped or a 991 from 2011 to present. 

 

Slippery
Slippery UberDork
4/2/22 8:43 p.m.

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

Actually this 996 does not have an IMS bearing wink

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
4/2/22 8:58 p.m.

In reply to Slippery :

Engine swap :).  It had one originally. 

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) MegaDork
4/2/22 9:25 p.m.
Slippery said:

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

Actually this 996 does not have an IMS bearing wink

 

Looks like you still have to drop the engine, when the VTC actuator goes bad.

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